New discussion on DAW's and Hardware Recorders

[Joey Ace]

Thanks. Here's the web site, with a nice video demo:

http://www.hgr2488.co.uk/

[Henry Matthews]

I think the 3200 is an awesome machine and would have gone to it if I would have known about the VGA monitor output. I had a Korg BR 1600 which I liked very well and loved the effects, especially the reverb and compressor. Very good effects. Only drawback was it wasn't very user friendly, to me anyway. Never did figure out how to use the virtual tracks and some other features on the board and also the touch screen wasn't accurate and far as what you touched. I finally wound up with a Roland VS-2480 loaded with 3 VS-2 cards and one VS-3 which has some really great plugins like Autotune and stereo reverbs and it will also record 16 tracks at once. I picked mine up on Ebay for about a $1000 I think and have had it 3 years. With the VGA monitor, very user friendly and the book is well detailed. Everything can work with a mouse and keyboard. Even thought these were made back in the late 90's, they are still top notch recorders however, been thinking about try a computer based recorder like Pro-tools but haven't gotten around to it yet. .

[Wayne Franco]

I was having trouble with the learning curve. I wasn't even familiar with common terms used in working with a DAW. The best thing I ever did was take a course from Berkley School of music on recording with Sonar. I'm much better now.

[Geoff Barnes]

Like a lot of people here; I started out with tape based (analogue) systems back when 4 track machines were the biggest and best systems available…. By the 80’s we were using 48 tracks (sort of…. 2x 24 linked).
I started playing around with computer systems when the Roland MC4 was released around 1981

and stayed with the Roland toys ‘til the Atari 1040ste arrived

with Notator/Unitor/Combiner which allowed us to synch our MIDI with the tape transport via smpte….

My bread and butter these days is composing music for the gaming industry. I designed a compact writer’s studio for the company I am currently working for.

Some of the tools in our arsenal at the moment are as follows;
Roland/Cakewalk Sonar; for sheer simplicity, MIDI and economy… It has a few issues that are annoying, but you get what you pay for, and they pack a lot into the program.
I recommend this software for anyone flogging product out of the boot/trunk of their car as it will allow one to record all the product they could ever need for less than what they would pay a “demo” studio to record an album.

Steinberg Nuendo; this is fairly new for us (around 1 year), but I’m quietly impressed with the quality of the finished product… it’s a bit fussy about accepting some video codecs (we are primarily an animation house… 90% of my work is delivered as still sequences…. Rendering twice is frustrating…. But Nuendo has some fantastic features and is worth persevering IMO… the onboard synths are a pleasant surprise.. automation is effortless.

Sony Vegas… Great little program for putting audio to images… will accept many codecs and still sequences…. (Alpha blending can cause it to stumble if there are too many layers)…Allows for multi-tracking audio and video.
Typically, I compose, record and master the music Themes” in Sonar or Nuendo, drop them under the animations and add the sfx in Vegas…. I could write a small book on my adventures with NLEs …But this is about DAWS.

Adobe Audition… we use this less and less now, but personally, I grew up with this as an editor and mastering app since it was Cool Edit pro… I occasionally use it for noise reduction out of habit… have never used it as a multi-track apart from the first morning I installed it (mainly to listen to the bundled samples which are in a proprietary format)… just feels a bit clumsy and dated IMO…. Adobe have just muddied the waters.

Sound Forge… these days this is my go-to editor and mastering app… straightforward and small learning curve.

Melodyne… back in the 90’s we used Antares Autotune… known locally as the “special compressor”… company policy was to never tell the vocalist what it really did.
Melodyne takes this process to a whole new level… an excellent program.

Pro tools HD… if you are serious about running a commercial studio you need to understand this system. Full stop.

If you are not running a commercial facility, then there are many more economical choices out there.
Sonar, CuBase, Logic and Pro Tools LE are all excellent and will deliver broadcast quality audio… It boils down to a “best fit”. For us it is a combination of the above stated toolset.

[Mike Neer]

I use Reaper on my PC for recording and mixing and Cool Edit Pro for some editing functions. However, when I need it quick, I have a Boss BR-8 that I just can't seem to part with--it is a very easy unit to use with a small footprint. The sound is not bad either if you can get a good signal going in to it. That, of course, is the key to any good recording: good sound in, good sound out.

[ed packard]

We cut Bill Stafford's album/CD on a Teac Simulsync 4 track 1/4" unit...direct in...he used earphones. Did not need "tracks" as the CD is just Bill and the PSG, done in one pass (can't believe this chap!).

I have played a bit with a number of DAW's = Audacity, Sound Forge, Crystal, n-tracks, Power Tracks, BIAB, and others...not Pro Tools. In my opinion, they should open with a simple screen that looks like the tape machine, then go from there. Drove me nuts trying to get into the mind of the programmers.

After getting into them, they each had something good, and something frustrating for us amateurs.

For my next long term project, I am going to go for the Cakewalk/Sonar X1 that will be released Dec 8...hello learning curve!

The project is a video/audio extension of the 32 PSG analysis done in Dec 06 at Jim Palenscar's shop. This time the PSG's performance will be recorded and the FSA etc. done after the fact from the recorded info.

[Brian McGaughey]

2Seemy...Cool!

I used a D3200 to record our band's last CD and I loved everything about the unit except the need of readers to view the display. This interface looks like just the ticket. Great info!

I've not spent any time on multi-track recording gear prior to my experience with the Korg D3200 but have spent years working with simple recording equipment while working in radio in the mid 70s. I understand most of the concepts.

I have a several year old version of Sonar and I find the Korg much more intuitive and easy to use. I've not invested the time to get over the hump with Sonar but use it mainly to record demos using biab tracks with steel and vocals.

Good to see you around, Bob!

[Teddy Ray Bullard II]

DAW recording is infinitely more flexible, and with proessing power being as high as it is today, it is really a solid choice. the "workstations" all in one things are ok for demos or whatever, for "one man bands" but not for serious working professionals.

other than something like the RADAR V(which I use).

[Bob Martin]

I had kind of forgot about this thread until it got bumped back up. As more and more of these adapters are being made to use with these hardware units I think we will see a pretty big resurgence in the sales and use of the hardware machines.

To be honest the 2 biggest stumbling blocks to these hardware units especially the older mre affordable have always been the small screens and the backup medium.

I've got an older Yamaha 16 trk. 16/24 bit machine the AW16g. It's a great sounding digital recorder, but the screen is terrible for me and the backup method is CD's very slow.

So now if we can get a kit for the older Yamaha's for a vga screen and an USB port to backup the whole contents of the hard drive or transfer single tracks for editing.

I'm guessing the USB mod will be a much bigger project and maybe not cost worthy. The fact that you can put a vga screen on the Tascam for 100.00 bucks I'd say they will sell like hotcakes and I watched the video and it looks like a 15 minute job with no soldering or destruction to the unit.

I did a quick search for vga upgrades for the AS16g but didn't see any but of course that doesn't mean someone hasn't made one.

Bob

[Tony Prior]

I had kind of forgot about this thread ...To be honest the 2 biggest stumbling blocks to these hardware units especially the older more affordable have always been the small screens and the backup medium.


Bob

Well said Mr Bob... Being a recording kid from the young age of probably 12 or so with my brothers Pentron Mono recorder, all the way up to modern PC based DAW's I would say that I have finally crossed over to the PC platform,fighting it all the way though... if for nothing else the ease of backup, editing and the ability to work on the final 2 track product.

Like many here, my experience has been with tape recorders, standalone workstations and such for the entire ride..

here's a few I can remember

Pentron mono, this is where the journey started...

Sony 350 ..1st exposure to unit SOS

Ampex something or other

Teac 144, bought it for $1000 when it 1st came out

Teac 80-8...now I'm in the big time( heavy too)

Early Cakewalk, loved it,used it along with the 80-8

Tascam Cassette 8 Track rack unit(liked this alot)

Boss BR-8, love it still have it...

Cubase LE..bah humbug..didn't work for me...

Yamaha AW2816, loved it but no file management

Boss Micro BR , liked it but sold it

Sonar Home Studio 7, like it still have it

Sonar 8.5, like it still have it

Zoom R16..love it, excellent file management

Pro-Tools 8...well...for me..no looking back now

The ability to take a final mix, listening back through the near fields , dragging the EQ bands, maximizers, compressors etc, while viewing the graphs in real time, saving different mixes then converting to wav or MP3 from within the DAW engine has pretty much pulled me over the line. And all this while viewing a large monitor !

It still gets back to using what you like and still playing well...all the recorders on the planet can't fix bad music, they can only make bad music sound sonically better !

t