You Have To Be Kidding

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 29 Jun 2004 5:49 pm

I've heard some Rap that I like. If nothing else, it has taught the old concept of rhyme to countless teenagers! It's a little thing, but back when I went to school, all poetry had rhyme! If it didn't rhyme, it was some form of prose. Nowadays, most poetry has no rhyme at all, and is instead, merely structure-less verbal meanderings expressing little writing talent.

It doesn't take much imagination to realize that Longfellow's poem, "Paul Revere's Ride", would make a dynamite rap song!

Sing it, Poop Doggy!

C Dixon · Post by **C Dixon** » 29 Jun 2004 6:08 pm

"who also happens to be one of us pesky Christ killin' Jews), I just wanted to completely avoid all the self riteous crap being said here

hmmmmm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>
"We live in the United States of America here, which entitles everyone to freedom of expression,"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

hmmmmm.

Since I perceive that first quote was directed towards "self righteous" Christians on this forum, I will USE the last quote to say, that I would to God that I was indeed a "self righteous" Christian.

Because IF I was, I would have attained something that NO human has ever attained, and that is my righteousness would have pleased God. And I have never pleased him in my entire life.

Because I am wretched sinner saved by the Grace of him when he came to this earth to shed his own blood to become the final blood sacrifice to atone for my sins, as well as all other sins, past, present AND future.

So I assure you, I am far from being anything associated with "riteous" because I am part and parcel of the wickedness of all men, and if my using my US rights in standing up for what I feel is a wrong is "self riteous crap", then

So be it!

May Jesus right all wrongs,

carl[This message was edited by C Dixon on 29 June 2004 at 07:09 PM.]

Ralph Willsey · Post by **Ralph Willsey** » 29 Jun 2004 7:25 pm

Is there not a Jesus forum for this type of discussion?

John Floyd · Post by **John Floyd** » 29 Jun 2004 8:31 pm

Joey Wrote

There were, and still are, many mainstream Country songs about lyin, cheatin, killin, etc.

Yes and the message in those songs was that it was wrong in just about all cases. There almost always was a moral to the story in those country songs, I'm not so sure about the modern day thing called Rap or Hip hop. I don't listen to that junk, but the message I get is they preach violence without consequence.[This message was edited by John Floyd on 29 June 2004 at 09:33 PM.]

Jim Phelps · Post by **Jim Phelps** » 29 Jun 2004 10:29 pm

.[This message was edited by Jim Phelps on 17 November 2004 at 08:11 PM.]

Jordan Shapiro · Post by **Jordan Shapiro** » 29 Jun 2004 11:15 pm

I was actually speaking more about musical self riteousness when I said that. I have a belief in a higher power that takes care of me, and I figure he's the same one that works for everyone on the planet if they let him. I'm not a religious fella, but to live a life of freedom from my own demons, I need to let something more powerful than myself guide me and my decisions.

I imagine he probably doesn't like rap music either.

I just might like rap more than a lot of stuff I see on CMT these days, I'm with you of the older school of country, and the fella that offered up the comment about the country songs ending up with a moral not a glorification of violence, drugs etc., you do have a good point, I don't buy it 100%, but I do believe it is probably more true than not, however the dangerous part is how poeple percieve what the artist is saying, not necessarily what he or she actually means.

Mr. Dixon, I didn't mean to say there was anything wrong with being a christian. I didn't, actually. But just wanted you to know that I wasn't attacking you folks, that's partly why I threw in the "pesky little Christ killin' Jews" line, so people would know I don't take names and labels so serious( Jordan Isaac Shapiro, Jew, check). I judge folks on their actions, not on what God they believe in.

Most everyone on this forum seems like "good folks" to me, and although I was feelin' a little anger from a couple of you, nobody really flipped out. Thank you for that.

now tell me the truth, if you had to sit in a room and listen to either a Snoop dog album, or a Shania Twain album, which one would you choose? And killing youself slowly instead is not an option here.

J ( who loves Canadians too, Joey. I grew up in Seattle playing hockey and went to Canada every other weekend for years. Love it up there. Redd Volkaert is a canuck, no more really need be said about our nieghbors to the north, they are fine folk.)

Craig A Davidson · Post by **Craig A Davidson** » 30 Jun 2004 2:04 am

Donny, I always thought that tune sounded better when you flipped the record and it played backwards. As far as country rap goes if people like it that's fine, but to quote Dale Watson: "Country My Ass". I am open minded on a lot if it but I can't hardly go the rap.

------------------
1985 Emmons push-pull,S-10 Marlin,Evans SE200,Hilton pedal

Joey Ace · Post by **Joey Ace** » 30 Jun 2004 3:01 am

John,
I could name plenty of country songs with bad messages no moral. Too numerous to mention. Even some Bluegrass standards.

They are art, describing real feelings and events, good and bad.

Not every song has to happy or have a moral, no matter what style.

I wouldn't want to live in a musical world of "Acky Breaky Heart" songs. I'd have to join Sam in his equipment destroying party.

David Mason · Post by **David Mason** » 30 Jun 2004 3:52 am

It seems clear to me that every generation of adolescents have their own style of music specifically designed to piss off and alarm their parents and elders as effectively as possible. The bobby-soxers had Sinatra, the greasers had Elvis, the hippies had the Beatles and the Dead, I had Led Zeppelin (Jimmy Page actually WAS a Satan-worshipper, you know). Give these kids their due - they know EXACTLY how to push your buttons, don't they?

Steinar Gregertsen · Post by **Steinar Gregertsen** » 30 Jun 2004 4:23 am

1 - Rap is what you make it. Just like country, blues, jazz, rock and polkas.
2 - Believe it or not, but I have seen and heard rap performed in church. Yes, it was the same silly waving arms and sideways caps, but the message was a Christian one.
It is a way of youths reaching out and getting a message across to other youths, and in this case somebody had decided to 'steal' the rap and turn it around to spread a positive message.

It really doesn't have to be more complicated than that......

Peace
Steinar

------------------
www.gregertsen.com

Rick McDuffie · Post by **Rick McDuffie** » 30 Jun 2004 4:28 am

Jordan, one of my good friends, Adam David Goldberg, is a fervent Baptist.

Obviously, he's also one of Abraham's children (but then, aren't we all?)

Things are not always as they seem, and I don't reach any conclusions based upon a person's last name.

I know that's not what this thread was about, but I wanted to "share".

By the way, I'm all for steel being played anywhere there's a paying gig! Any publicity is good publicity.[This message was edited by Rick McDuffie on 30 June 2004 at 05:28 AM.]

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 30 Jun 2004 4:34 am

I am with John F, I hear a lesson in life in most country songs. It's one thing to mention a bad deed and "this is what it got me". It's another thing to encourage the doing of a bad deed, with implying no consequence, and targeting this at young impressionable teens. The lyrics are the turn-off for me concerning Rap, then next is the "what they call music" noise in rap. But then that's just me. HA!! It ain't a perfect world out there, and Rap is livin' proof! So is Achey Breaky.

Theresa Galbraith · Post by **Theresa Galbraith** » 30 Jun 2004 4:54 am

Samuel,
I'm wondering what Country Rap your talking about?

Theresa

Herb Steiner · Post by **Herb Steiner** » 30 Jun 2004 5:03 am

"Country Rap" is nothing to get worked up over, it's simply a momentary distraction to see if it could be done. A diversion from the musical sameness the industry foists on an unsuspecting audience once in a while. I seriously doubt that in 50 years any of the current CR songs will be performed, as "Fraulein" and "Crazy Arms" are today.

Why don't you leave them boys alone, and let them sing their song?

Thanks, Waymore.

------------------
Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association

Robbie Bossert · Post by **Robbie Bossert** » 30 Jun 2004 5:22 am

Well, Rap Sucks.....New Country Sucks......Combined it will be twice as bad.....Therefore, it should make a helluva' lot of money.....Isn't that what it's all about these days?

Robbie Bossert

John Floyd · Post by **John Floyd** » 30 Jun 2004 5:28 am

Is there not a Jesus forum for this type of discussion?

Yes there is, Right here if Carl Dixon wants it to be.

I don't need to defend Carl, There is a higher power that will give him all the defense he needs,but I do want to show support for him and his right to express his religous beliefs. He imparts a Great deal of knowledge and wisdom to this forum and we need him and ALL of his messages.

------------------
 The Southern Steel Guitar Convention at Saluda, SC Since 1987

For informstion on the Shriners Childrens Hospitals, go to:
http://www.shrinershq.org/hospitals/geninfo.html

Joey Ace · Post by **Joey Ace** » 30 Jun 2004 6:00 am

There are "House Rules" here, and one is the definition of this Forum Section:

"MUSIC - Musical topics not directly related to steel guitar."

I'm enjoying this discourse, and mutual respect (for the most part). Too often these discussions are forced into an early close by folks dragging them into other areas.

Bill Llewellyn · Post by **Bill Llewellyn** » 30 Jun 2004 7:32 am

Some folks consider Toby Keith's "I wanna Talk About Me" to be rap. I'd never thought about it that way until it was mentioned on the SGF, I rather thought of it more like the style of Johnny Cash's "A Boy named Sue." I think just the speaking of any lyrics over any music or percussive rhythm doesn't necessarily make the result rap or hiphop. I think rap/hiphop in particular has an intentional edge to the voice....a cockiness, if you will. (I've not heard a lot of hiphop, but I've certainly never heard a love song done in that style.) The music also has a very characteristic and recognizable (rather inflexible, if you will) pattern to the drums or percussion that seems requisite. (If that particular backbeat is used in jazz, the form is called "acid jazz".) I'm not sure that if you combine the hiphop backbeat, words spoken with an edgy tone of voice, and down home lyrics, that you still have country, even if you call it country-rap.

------------------
Bill, steelin' since '99 | Steel page | My music | Steelers' birthdays | Over 50?

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 30 Jun 2004 8:01 am

Let's do fusion and country---we'll call it confusion! (Somebody probably tried it already---I was at the airport when my ship came in.")

Leigh Howell · Post by **Leigh Howell** » 30 Jun 2004 8:40 am

It seems to me that this has turned into a who likes rap, and who doesn't subject. The original post was, why do they have to try to merge it with country? I agree with Sam. But I also agree that if someone likes rap, good for them. But please dont lump county, and rap together!!
Leigh

Sam White R.I.P. · Post by **Sam White R.I.P.** » 30 Jun 2004 8:46 am

Jordon fist of all and final. Carl Dixon is one great Gentalman and if you have not met him you should you would appreciate him.

Tresea I'm talking about the Counrty Rap that is on CMT. Those woman look like they belong on a street corner and I would not want my grand children to see that S--- on TV.End of Story.

Sam White

Sam White R.I.P. · Post by **Sam White R.I.P.** » 30 Jun 2004 8:52 am

I will say one thing do not pick on Carl Dixon he is a Great gentalman and should be treated so.

Treasa I'm talking about the Country Rap on CMT. I would not want my Grandchildren to see the way those woman dress.They look like they came of the street corner. End of Stroy.

Herb that is fine let them play there rap Juck but not on the TV where young people see that garbage.
Sam White

Jordan Shapiro · Post by **Jordan Shapiro** » 30 Jun 2004 10:42 am

Hey there now, Samuel, I was actually expressing respect for Calrs' beliefs, and adding that I had a God in my life as well. I figure everyones' prayers end up falling on the same ears ultimately, nomatter what they call him.

As far as the music is concerned, I'm with the fella that would rather destroy his stuff than play rap on it, in a way.The fella I work with plays Burrito Bros sounding country and tends to then add a little good natured rap poking fun at folks in the audience or the band members. I would rather not play with an outfit that has the fake drums and synthasized bass etc., etc. I am surprised that my friend Greg McMullen hasn't chimed in here yet. He is really interested in playing with more sort of ambient, hip hop type folks, and loves taking the steel into that realm. I am not interested in that stuff, but side with him in the mindset that pushes him in that direction. Fearless exploration is to be respected, in my book. Although I'm with Herb in a bigger sense, that a lot of the music being made today will most likely not stand the test of time as well as the more pure forms of music.

I 'm sure there are many classical fans who think jazz to be an abomination, and many jazz lovers that feel country music raped their art form and started yodeling over the top of it ! Etc, Etc.

Let me tell you, I was not a jazz lover a few years back. I was also having an adverse reaction to music theory every time someone would bring it up. I started playing the steel guitar and here I am 2 and a half years later with Django Reinhart and Wes Montgomery records in my collection. I am now learning more about Why a 7th chord wants to "get up and go somewhere else" and where it wants to go, and why those diminished minor 7th chords are movable up and down the fretbord or how they can be used to get from a IV to a V chord.

I would take a minute here to thank Buddy and Jimmy Day(and so many others) for expanding the musical vocabulary of the steel guitar so long ago, and the new guard of Redd Volkaert and crew in Austin for keeping the fusion of jazz and country(real country) alive and well.

There will always be things that rub us the wrong way, but the folks that I respect most in my travels through the world are the ones that never seem to bash anything, sort of a peaceful knowledge that there is a higher purpose in the world. That petty arguments about whos music or God or food or job is the right one for everyone just end up hurting or ailienating people that could benefit from all of these things.

And as far as not liking the girls in little dresses on CMT,....................uh..................you don't happen to own a bunch of Liberace albums do you? That might explain your reation to the girls. I, for one can't say I like all the music on CMT, but I don't really have a problem with the girls on there.

As I was driving to my Sat. honky tonk gig, I was listening to Dale Watson and my 66 Ford truck started to shake and pulse wildly. I thought maybe the motor mounts had broken loose and my engine was about to come through the firewall. Then the car with speakers the size of King Kongs nuts pulled up next to me, and I realized that my truck was going to be just fine. I smiled at the kids and nodded my head at them, and they nodded back.

All ended well that evening, except I played like I had never touched a steel guitar before that night !!

Cheers,

J

Chip Fossa · Post by **Chip Fossa** » 30 Jun 2004 8:11 pm

Man,
I'm really cornfused now.

Bob Wood · Post by **Bob Wood** » 30 Jun 2004 8:26 pm

Huh?