Does Country Music actually exist ......anymore?

Larry Robbins · Post by **Larry Robbins** » 1 Dec 2003 3:26 pm

There is still country music out there,but not much on the radio these days

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Sho-Bud ProII
"there's been an awful murder, down on music row!"

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 2 Dec 2003 7:18 am

Well, the kind of country you're talking about exists, but it's not being played on most large stations. Almost 65% of the radio stations in the United States are owned by only 4 companies, and they don't play "classic country". There are some independent stations (most 5,000 watts or less) that still play it, but they're mostly in outlying areas you might not visit. Also, since their reception areas are very small, chances are you'd drive right through them in an hour or two. Unless you're constantly scanning the airwaves, you'll miss these stations.

I've found you have a much better chance of hearing unique programming (such as classic country) on the AM stations.

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 2 Dec 2003 8:18 am

This guy is who you should talk to:

and his toady:

These guys are strip mining our culture for the sake of personal gain. They have manipulated regulation and deregulation with great skill and when you turn on the radio you see what we get. The economy of scale doesn't mean things get better or even more efficient for that matter. The guy in the first picture has decided that there will be no country music in any form on the radio in the NYC area.

Bob

Rick Ulrich · Post by **Rick Ulrich** » 2 Dec 2003 10:12 am

Myron, you definitely won't hear it in the Phoenix area. The two stations in the Phoenix area that proclaim to be country, can't be identified as such just by listening. If you put your radio on scan and it comes to those stations you wouldn't suspect they consider themselves country. The last time classic country was heard around here was back before Buck Owens sold his interest in the station at 1580 on the AM dial. The station was the original KNIX but had changed to KCWW when they moved KNIX to FM. I can't pick it up from Gilbert, but there was a station in Wickenburg that played classic country. A station in Tucson used to play classic country, but it also doesn't come in very well in the Phoenix area. Keep buying the CD's of the older stuff, I know my collection keeps growing.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 2 Dec 2003 11:16 am

Kinda hard to imagine the top execs not considering Alan Jacksons over 40 million CD's sold ..as a traditional Country Boy..

Kinda makes a statement like..

" Yipes..how do we get 40 million in CD sales ? "

T

Walter Stettner · Post by **Walter Stettner** » 2 Dec 2003 2:24 pm

Myron,

If you wanna hear pure country, check out the records that Justin Trevino has out - pure country, but I don't think you will hear too much of it on the radio!!!
Walter

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Joe Miraglia · Post by **Joe Miraglia** » 2 Dec 2003 5:13 pm

Is Alan Jackson,George Strait, Brad Pasley Country?They play their songs on the radio all the time. If they are not country,then country dosn't exist. What is it we want? Every song like the 60"s ! Toby sings -I love this bar- It's not country, If Hank Jr. or Merle Haggard do it that makes it country. Yes there is alot out there I do not like, but back then and I do go back aways, there was alot I didn't like then. Lets not give up on the new ones, some day one will come along and sound just like ET.Or Webb Pierce

Joe[This message was edited by Joe Miraglia on 02 December 2003 at 06:04 PM.]

Chris Lasher · Post by **Chris Lasher** » 2 Dec 2003 9:25 pm

I'm with Joe, on this one. If you're telling me that those three guys aren't Country, then no, Country music doesn't exist anymore.

Your options are:
1) Update your definition of Country music
2) Keep your definition of Country music, and become a musical hermit, shunning the creative potential of the present
3) Figure out a way to get young'uns like myself into what you define as Country music; for example, as one of the other members has discussed in the Demographics thread, go to a high school and play your songs in front of the students in the music classes

I think a combination of 1) and 3) works best. You walk halfway, I walk halfway, and we meet in the middle. I learn the valuable musical history that you hold and pass it on down, and you learn to see and respect the validity in the music I enjoy listening to.

If I don't give another person's music a chance, why should he or she give my music a chance?

Jussi Huhtakangas · Post by **Jussi Huhtakangas** » 3 Dec 2003 3:36 am

3rd Coast Music magazine maintains a website called FAR-chart ( Freeform American Roots Chart ), which compiles monthly the most played roots music cd's by freeform dj's on public, college and community radio stations. The stations and dj's are listed and there are links to the websites of the stations. If you want to know what's really happening in country music ( and related music styles ) outside the cheesy stuff and CMT, you might want to check out the FAR-chart ( archives available too ). Chances are, you'll find tons of stuff you love but never heard of before.

Jussi Huhtakangas · Post by **Jussi Huhtakangas** » 3 Dec 2003 3:43 am

Sorry, forgot the website address: http://3rdcm.austinamericana.com

Craig A Davidson · Post by **Craig A Davidson** » 3 Dec 2003 4:09 am

When a radio station starts playing Buck and Merle back to back with Tim and Kenny, then we will have something. That is my only gripe, that you can't hear the old stuff. To me, a country station should play it all.

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1985 Emmons push-pull,Evans SE200

Chris Lasher · Post by **Chris Lasher** » 3 Dec 2003 5:27 am

To me, a country station should play it all.

I completely agree. A lot more people need to agree to that, though, before they're played again. It's a catch-22, though, because if they don't get played on the radio, how are people going to know they want to hear them played on the radio? Considering that there are so few rock stations that play rock music from the 60s to the present, though, there's a fat chance for country stations to do better.

I think the best bet is in live music. After all, you won't hear Dixieland Jazz on the radio anymore, but you can still find people playing it (Jim Cullum Jazz Band, Preservation Hall Jazz Band, etc.)

Wayne Carver · Post by **Wayne Carver** » 3 Dec 2003 6:14 am

I think the problem with radio, no matter what musical genre, is that itplays only the same 30 or 40 songs over & over.
While it's true that a handful of the performers are country singers on the radio, alot of them aren't. There are a lot of true country performers out there they just don't get any radio play. The genre of alt. country is more country that the radio stuff.Maybe with satellite redio we'll have more choices.

Fred Shannon · Post by **Fred Shannon** » 3 Dec 2003 6:49 am

[This message was edited by Fred Shannon on 06 December 2004 at 01:20 AM.]

C Dixon · Post by **C Dixon** » 3 Dec 2003 8:22 am

Country music (as defined by many of us) needs NO definition. It needs NO coming together with newer sounds so we appease ANY one, etc, etc. It stands on its own. And there is not one of us true "country" fans who does not know instantly when it "ain't" country.

In other words, if ever younger listeners do not care for the older sounds, and they love the newer sounds, that is fine. I have NO problem with that. My only problem from day one, (since Evlis began the demise of "country music"), is what they call it.

Ray Price said it best of all, on the stage, when he said, "why don't they simply call it what is.....Rock and Roll?"

If you like R & R, fine. But please don't call if country. That is my ONLY beef. And you aren't ever going to make it country by mixing things in it that us "country" folk don lack

One can give a billy-goat mother's milk all day and all night forever, and you can dress it up in diapers, pants, scanty attire, evenin' gowns, or any other apparel, but it will never make it a human being. You can sell it to the whole world and cause most everyone you meet to buy into it, but as Buddy Emmons said, "it does not matter what somebody says or how many times they say it, the facts remain the same".

A number of producers, singers and those who fell (and fall) in love with Rock and Roll, have tried (sadly sucessfully) to force itself into "country" music". Prime examples of this are Guy Mitchel, Andy Williams, Garth Brooks, Shania Twain, Faith Hill, Martina McBride, Billy Ray Cyrus, Brooks and Dunn, etc, etc.

Many others continue to try and "force" it. It hasn't worked and it never will. What they sing and the WAY they sing it and HOW they sing it proves to ANY true country fan, that it is simply "ain't" country.

This IS the reason for this thread. It is the reason for the many times it has been brought up on this forum. Again I have NO problem if you like what they call "country" today. MY problem will always be calling it "country music".

Ray was absolutely right, and NO better authority on this earth than him to put it into words. Since RAY is the ultimate "country" singer. None better in this world. If he says it "ain't country" that should be good enough for all.

Cuz it aint!!

Flame on bruthah

carl

Leigh Howell · Post by **Leigh Howell** » 3 Dec 2003 8:35 am

I think everyone is entitled to their own opinion as to what is and what is'nt country.
But I agree with you Carl. (And Ray Price)
I personally like most kinds of music, and try to keep an open mind. But dont play Rock, or Pop, Or Jazz, or whatever, and call it country. But thats what the suits are going to do, so they can sell their product. Etc. etc. etc.
Leigh[This message was edited by Leigh Howell on 03 December 2003 at 08:36 AM.]

Gene Jones · Post by **Gene Jones** » 3 Dec 2003 9:16 am

Two more "pure" artists who never tried to call the music they played "country", was Bob Wills and Hank Thompson. They were proud of the "western-swing" genre that they represented.

www.genejones.com

Nicholas Dedring · Post by **Nicholas Dedring** » 3 Dec 2003 11:30 am

I don't have a hard time finding real country, mainly because we don't have country radio in New York City.

It takes some looking, but there is so much good stuff being made if you're willing to dig into alternate sources... Mike Ireland, Justin Trevino, Laura Cantrell, The Derailers, Robbie Fulks, Rex Hobart, and many many more are making good, honest music with real country sensibilities, and a varying quantity of new ideas and thoughts.

I guess I never listened to pop radio to find non-country music, so I don't expect to find good music on country or non-country mainstream radio...

It's been said on here before that it's about "young people" poisoning the well... I think you just have to look at music being made in the assorted dens of "young people" with urban sensibilities to see that that's a misapprehension. A friend who lives in Lawrence Kansas mentioned that there's an amazing amount of good bluegrass being played there, and Austin is home to an amazing movement of new country/Americana acts... don't despair, people; just don't keep swallowing what the machine is trying to feed us.

You might want to try XM satellite radio... there's a traditional country station, as well as a bluegrass station, and an Americana station... we get them on digital cable here as well, and it's been a source of interesting finds from time to time.[This message was edited by Nicholas Dedring on 03 December 2003 at 11:32 AM.]

Rick Ulrich · Post by **Rick Ulrich** » 3 Dec 2003 11:43 am

This may be slightly off topic, but somehow I think it fits this discussion. Have you noticed how many televisions commercials seem to be using steel guitar as their background music recently? I have noticed it quite a bit. Yet, we keep hearing that producers and such don't want the sound of the steel in music because it makes it too country. It's funny, but these producers of TV commercials must see some value in it.

John Floyd · Post by **John Floyd** » 3 Dec 2003 1:32 pm

Country Music started out as a Southern Music in The Applachian Mountains of the south mostly from Irish Immigrants (Fiddlers). Since that time everybody else has jumped on the bandwagon and tried to Change it to suit themselves and thats why its in the mess its in today. If a person can't speak its native Language, what right do they have in changing it? To many Changers and not enough of them aware of its roots or even care for the heritage behind Country Music. It used to be called HillBilly Music, maybe we should give Country Music to the idiots and go back to being Hillbillies. Do you think they would try to move in on that also. Probably if they thought they could make a quick buck.

I'm with my Georgia Bro Carl ....Flame on.<a href='http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb008' target='_blank'><img src='http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/8/8_4_11.gif' border=0></a><a href='http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb008' target='_blank'><img src='http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/8/8_4_10.gif' border=0></a>[This message was edited by John Floyd on 03 December 2003 at 03:04 PM.]

Larry Robbins · Post by **Larry Robbins** » 3 Dec 2003 1:47 pm

Yep,got to agree with MR.Dixon on this one!
I dont have a problem with what most stations are calling "country "music these days.In fact I like some of it.But its about as country as" Kid Rock"Call a spade a spade and a shovel a shovel.And please call it what it really is,rock and roll.Some of it is well done.Some of it aint.But what it
AINT is country and you all know what we mean.Just call it what it is and throw in
some of our "traditional"country songs here and there and we'ed all be a lot happier.
"Ive seen the Grand old Opry,and Ive met
Johnny Cash...if thats not country I'll kiss your a$$"

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Sho-Bud ProII
"there's been an awful murder, down on music row!"

Walter Stettner · Post by **Walter Stettner** » 3 Dec 2003 1:52 pm

Some amazingly good comments here!!!

I think that "Country" is drifiting more and more apart in definition. There are those who define country music from its heritage (George and Merle and Buck, if you don't wanna go back too far to singers like ET, Hank Snow etc) and those who learned (through radio and other sources) that Country is Shania Twain, Faith Hill etc.) We'll end up with both talking about Country Music but meaning two totally different musical forms!

Walter

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Chris Lasher · Post by **Chris Lasher** » 3 Dec 2003 3:55 pm

I was going to argue some more, but memory got the best of me. I'm going to quote a very talented musician that I admire and leave this thread be. I think it says everything I should say and keeps me from saying anything else that I shouldn't.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>
Audience member: "What do you say to people that say that you're breaking tradition by playing techniques like harmonics and thumping and tapping...?"

Victor Wooten: "...I'd ask them 'Okay, what is tradition?' and whatever they said, I could show them a time when that wasn't tradition. You know what I mean? And a lot of us who are trying to 'keep it bebop,' I could show you when bebop wasn't tradition. You know, the people who were playing bebop, they were stretching--they were living on the edge. That's' where the ideas come from. You know? I mean, when the car was invented, the guy who invented the horse and buggy was probably really mad, right? But that's evolution. When you're a two year old, you're this tall [gestures at knees]; now you're this tall [gestures at head]. You grow up. That's what it's about. That's totally what it's about. But everyone's allowed to their opinion, you know? I wouldn't try to change it for him. If he wanted to think that, that's fine with me."
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Joe Miraglia · Post by **Joe Miraglia** » 3 Dec 2003 4:53 pm

Maybe we should stop calling it Country Music,and call it MUSIC! Then a steel guitar player might be called a musician,Country Music is music,but we are trying to separate it thats ok,we like what we like. but it is music first(their many people who say country music is not music)and we keep talking about what is country?.Joe[This message was edited by Joe Miraglia on 03 December 2003 at 04:57 PM.]